CEREC with Indenco stains!
Does anybody have any experience with the Indenco polychromatic stains for e-max , are they much better than the Ivoclar e-max stains ? They claim that it is translucent and hence more life like !
On 6/27/2015 at 4:18 pm, Moe Tabesh said... Does anybody have any experience with the Indenco polychromatic stains for e-max , are they much better than the Ivoclar e-max stains ? They claim that it is translucent and hence more life like !
True, but there is a learning curve. Dave Edelson is using them with success.
I just got them last week. I think they are nice but I'm having trouble when placing it on unfired emax. The fast cycle virtually eliminates the color and they come out pretty plain looking. When I do multiple fires and all subsequent cycles are on the empress cycle, they turn out pretty well. Talk to Tony Siragusa at Indenco. He's helpful and if he doesn't know an answer, he'll get one for you from someone who does know.
Moe, Yes I've been using them for some time now. Adam, yes there is a sligt learning curve to it and yes Tony can help too. Essentially the shade pastes and stains are a different consistency than you're probably used to. They're a little grainier. I essentially place the corresponding shade paste on the cervical and occlusal to increase the chroma in those areas and give a dentin appearence. Then I use the V1 incisal on the cusp tips and on to the buccal and lingual 1/3's and cuspal inclines as well as the marginal ridges. I'll then use white whisps on the cuspal inclines too. Very diluted blue on the marginal ridges. Adam and Moe, lay it on a little thicker as well. Don't be shy with it. Adam that's why you are getting a washed out look. I get the results I get in one P3 crystallization fire. I have never had to refire. I'd do a video if I knew how. Or the developer Jim Emmons is available to talk by phone or for travel costs only will come to a study club meeting if you both belong to one. But you should be able to get these results too. I truly believe it's the only system that gives a monochromatic block a polychromatic look. See the results below and on this previous thread. https://www.cerecdoctors.com/discussion-boards/view/id/40199
His contact info is:
Jim Emmons CDT, FNBC469-301-4840 / 877-894-4372 Toll free
Jim Emmons & Co. LLC /Jim@Spectrafire.com
Polychromatic Shading System / JimE@indenco.com
Just did this crown this morning. So I thought I'd take some pictures to show how much paste I put on. Now in an effort to emphasize it maybe I got a little to heavy on the occlusal and got a little to grainy? Because of the size of the crown I also used a larger brush and not normally what I typically use. But I think you'll get the gist. It burns off so don't be shy if you think it's to clumpy. It's more like a "filled" porcelain stain. So it's A shade paste, Z1 Incisal, blue on the marginal ridges and white on the cuspal inclines with Magenta interproximally cervically. Notice the depth effect on the marginal ridges. I did use the original spray glaze though not the new flourescent one. Grabbed the wrong can. My bad.
After seeing several post about Idenco spray glaze I ordered some. At Ivoclar we were taught 3 applications of their spray glaze with drying under oven hood between applications. Same technique for Idenco?
Yes but I don't dry under hood other than the normal drying time before lid closes via the preset program. I will say the original spray glaze seems to dry faster anyway. The flourescent is a little runnier.
Is the fluorescent really that fluorescent? I know Mike has spent a lot of time on this, but any updates?
To the naked eye it's tough to tell any difference. But I think the flourescent does look a little better in the end result.
David, do you use three coats of the indenco? I find a brief puff on each side of the crown to be adequate with the Indenco material.
I think most of the flourescent material is burned off at crystalization temperatures, I do not see much, if any, difference between the old and new formula.
